Weekly Poll #225

4/7/2024

Here are the results for last week's poll:
What is your favorite episode featuring a villain from a comic book/TV series coming to life?
Mask of the Blue Falcon - 18
The Schnook That Took My Comic Book - 11
The Scarab Lives! - 9
Scooby in Kwackyland - 9
Comic Book Caper - 3
A Scary Duel with a Cartoon Ghoul - 3

58 Comments

JakeSDfan27

4/7/2024 08:18:23 am

The Frickert Fracas (Good)

The Ghost of the Red Baron (Good)

Farmed and Dangerous (Great)

Eating Crow (Really Good and Creepy)

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 09:36:47 am

Great ratings!

Becker

4/7/2024 08:29:00 am

The Frickert Fracas definitely! One of the most easily entertaining episodes of NSDMo, with a guest that fit amazingly well. The other choices are good too, but they don't come near the iconicness of The Frickert Fracas.

Becker

4/7/2024 09:52:16 am

A Scooby-Doo Halloween would be my second choice, usual WNSD greatness. The Horrible Herd is third, one of the more sinister and messed up SDMI episodes, quite serious and unsettling. Curse of the Collar is a good APNSD episode, and I think we can all thank it wholeheartedly for inadvertedly resulting in the follow-up appearance of Buster — Catcher on the Sly!

Becker

4/7/2024 08:30:23 am

Off-topic, but I decided to marathon all of Scooby-Doo and Scrappy-Doo (1979–1980) the past week. I was incentivized to do so after our discussions on last week's poll about it. I hadn't properly watched these episodes in quite a long time, thus I wondered if my opinions on this season had changed. In the end, I think of it more or less the same as I did before: good but not great show. Although the rewatch was definitely worth it to finally have these episodes cemented in my mind more clearly rather than foggy memories, and to be able to make clearer distinctions between them. I enjoyed doing it.

Great Tier
1) The Night Ghoul of Wonderworld
2) The Demon of the Dugout
3) The Scarab Lives!

Very Good Tier
4) I Left My Neck in San Francisco
5) When You Wish Upon a Star Creature
6) The Ghoul, the Bat and the Ugly

Good Tier
7) Twenty Thousand Screams Under the Sea
8) Strange Encounters of a Scooby Kind
9) Lock the Door, It's a Minotaur!

Decent Tier
10) Shiver and Shake, That Demon's a Snake
11) The Neon Phantom of the Roller Disco!
12) The Scary Sky Skeleton

Okay Tier
13) Rocky Mountain Yiiiii!
14) The Sorcerer's a Menace
15) The Hairy Scare of the Devil Bear

Bruh Tier
16) The Ransom of Scooby Chief

Funny enough — as seen from the ranking — these episodes seem to come in bundles of 3 for me up until the last one. Another thing that stood out during the marathon was the lack of consistency. You'd have a number of stronger episodes in a row followed by a number of weaker episodes in a row. This pattern happened twice, broken up in the middle randomly by the second best episode followed by the second worst episode. Again, I don't dislike any of these episodes bar the last one though.

So yeah, quality control was a bit wack, in more ways than one. Like, the animation was so up and down, but more down than up. It definitely dipped compared to TSDS. You'd have "The Scarab Lives!" and "The Demon of the Dugout" with some really nice animation, not quite on par with some of the best of TSDS, but definitely on par or maybe more than the typical TSDS episode — but then you'd have "Shiver and Shake, That Demon's a Snake", which had arguably the worst animation the franchise had ever seen from '69 to '79.

Becker

4/7/2024 08:31:36 am

Feel free to ask any questions regarding the placements of the episodes or other general thoughts on aspects of this series!

Matt

4/7/2024 09:32:31 am

It is funny how despite how much more I like the season than you do, we both ended up with the same favorite episode lol. Night Ghoul of Wonderworld is such an excellent and creative episode

I may be remembering incorrectly so you could be right, but I don’t think I agree with Demon Snake having the worst animation of that era because there was some ROUGH animation in the New Scooby Doo Movies, particularly in season 2. It didn’t affect my opinions on the episodes, but there were times the animation looked very cheap

I kinda feel similarly to what you described in terms of animation inconsistency in season 3 of the Scooby Doo Show. On one hand, you have the elevator scene in Make a Beeline Away From That Feline, and on the other there were some rough spots the best I remember. I think Creepy Creature of Vulture’s Claw comes to mind there if I am remembering correctly. Of course, it can be argued that the inconsistency in the animation is more excusable in that season as they were outsourcing certain scenes, like that elevator scene. I don’t know the full extent of how much they were outsourcing but yeah

Becker

4/7/2024 10:06:34 am

The only TSDS S3 episodes with rougher animation that normal were "Jeepers, It's the Jaguaro" and "The Creepy Creature of Vulture's Claw" iirc. It was pretty consistent otherwise, despite the style of some of the later episodes looking slightly different due to said outsourcing, yet the quality itself was still about on par.

True, maybe some NSDMo eps had more rough animation throughout (partly due to the longer runtime), I agree there were a lot of animation errors in that show too. But, as far as I can recall, "Shiver and Shake, That Demon's a Snake" might have the single worst piece of animation in a scene during the classic '69-'79 era, namely the scene where the gang are leaving Haiti and boarding the boat, right before Shaggy finds the key. The characters were literally as tall as that huge boat (and not because of skewed perspective), I had to do a double take when I saw it lol. Idk why that particular moment has stuck with me so much, but it's like the definitive example of horrible animation. However, I wouldn't say the animation detracts that much from my opinion on the episodes, just a bit, as it does sometimes hinder scenes in a way.

Matt

4/7/2024 12:21:46 pm

Imo, the definitive example of horrible animation is not in the timeframe, but is this… https://ibb.co/QkDXYwX

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:16:04 pm

I would have to agree with Matt on this one, it doesn't get much worse than that lol.

Becker

4/7/2024 01:19:39 pm

The Scrappy shorts are their own category of bad lol. Shiver and Shake is a piece of art compared to some of the stuff of the first dark age haha

Matt

4/7/2024 09:38:03 am

As far as my ranking goes:

Excellent tier:
1. Night Ghoul of Wonderworld
2. Shiver and Shake, That Demon’s a Snake
3. The Scarab Lives
4. I Left My Neck in San Francisco
5. The Ghoul, the Bat, and the Ugly

Great tier:
6. When You Wish Upon a Star Creature
7. The Sorcerer’s a Menace
8. Demon of the Dugout

Good tier:
9. Neon Phantom of the Roller Disco
10. Twenty Thousand Screams Under the Sea
11. Rocky Mountain Yiiiiii!
12. Lock the Door, It’s the Minotaur
13. The Scary Sky Skeleton

Decent tier:
14. Strange Encounters of a Scooby Kind
15. Hairy Scare of the Devil Bear

WTF tier
16. Ransom of Scooby Chief

Becker

4/7/2024 10:20:11 am

I'm really shocked by your #2. I honestly didn't feel it was that special of an episode at all, just middle of the road. The Snake Demon wasn't that great of a villain, his design is a giant snake with limbs, it didn't make much sense to me why they'd even call it a snake at that point. He wasn't intimidating at all either, he kept trying to intercept Shaggy and the dogs at every chance for the key. The lack of atmosphere didn't help either. The mystery of who it was wasn't as easy as normal though tbf. However, a massive question I have is what was the point of the snake statue? It's initially presented as a big plot point and the thing that enables some kind of curse on the gang, but then it gets lost in the sea and is never seen or referenced again. I don't get what that was about.

Matt

4/7/2024 12:20:20 pm

I have a lot of love for that episode. I liked the Snake Demon even if he was a bit ridiculous, I don’t really have an issue with that. I really liked the atmosphere of the boat actually, and the plot and mystery was not only harder to figure out but was very clever and well thought out.

As far as the snake statue, I viewed it more as a misdirection than anything, as well as an assumed explanation that covers up why he is really there for a bit longer. I’ll give you that I don’t know why the Snake Demon looked so happy to get the statue, but I assume it may be just him playing along for the time being. I don’t have an issue with it

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:18:36 pm

I really liked the Snake Demon as a villain, and I'd go so far as to say that his ridiculousness is what made him such a good villain lol. I also loved the atmosphere of the boat and felt this episode was a bit darker than many other episodes in the series, but that might just be me. I've also always found it odd that the Snake Demon looked so happy to get the statue despite it not meaning anything. Maybe he just thought it looked nice lol.

Becker

4/7/2024 01:31:05 pm

I didn't feel the boat really had any atmosphere when it wasn't nighttime, and the scenes outside the boat even less. I wish they had made the monster look more threatening if they weren't actually gonna make him look like neither a demon nor a snake. Your explanation about the snake statue is good, too bad it wasn't written into the episode and instead was seemingly just forgotten about by the writer. I agree about the mystery having a lot of plausible suspects and subtle clues, it was great.

@Wildwind, I personally felt it was one of the lightest episodes of the show, there wasn't anything particularly dark about it that we wouldn't see in most Scooby episodes. The end of the episode is especially light once they get to New Orleans, but also most non-boat scenes as well.

Matt

4/7/2024 03:24:28 pm

To be fair, I found the New Orleans scene to actually be a bit scary for this series, when you realize the danger that Scooby, Shaggy, and Scrappy are in, it feels a bit more high stakes, even in daylight

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 05:49:16 pm

Yeah, the New Orleans scenes felt high-stakes to me as well, even if the snake was wearing a clown suit lol. I agree the daylight scenes were a bit less creepy than the night scenes, but I still felt a lot of the scenes at night were especially creepy for the episode. It has been a bit since I've seen the episode though, so I may be misremembering how many scenes took place at night.

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 09:47:45 am

I think I'd rank them something like this:

Great Tier
1. The Ghoul, The Bat and the Ugly
2. I Left My Neck in San Francisco
3. The Night Ghoul of Wonderworld

Very Good Tier
4. The Scarab Lives
5. Shiver and Shake, That Demon's a Snake
6. Lock the Door, It's a Minotaur
7. The Demon of the Dugout

Good Tier
8. Strange Encounters with a Scooby Kind
9. The Scarab Lives!
10. The Demon of the Dugout
11. When You Wish Upon a Star Creature

Decent Tier
12. The Neon Phantom of the Roller Disco!
13. The Sorcerer's a Menace

Meh Tier
14. The Scary Sky Skeleton
15. Rocky Mountain Yiiiii!

Bruh Tier
16,000. Ransom of Scooby Chief

Agreed there's definitely a lack of consistency among the episodes, not even just from episode to episode, but there were some episodes that had really promising starts and then quickly went downhill. "The Scary Sky Skeleton" is a great example of that - really promising setting and plot, and then they kinda just don't do all that much interesting with it, and the skeleton's design seems to go back and forth from being really creepy (the scenes in the plane) to clearly just some dude in a bone suit lol.

@Matt When I interviewed Duane Poole, he mentioned that the episodes were outsourced to another country. I believe he said the episodes wouldn't come back until a week or so before they had to send it to the network, so there was a very short time window to fix any animation errors that were made, thus why there were so many in the early era of Scooby. I'm guessing that's probably responsible for the inconsistency in animation here too.

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 09:48:19 am

Hairy Scare of the Devil Bear should be #10.

Becker

4/7/2024 10:20:45 am

@Wildwind, The Scarab Lives appears twice on your ranking.

Becker

4/7/2024 10:29:11 am

Similarly surprised by the high placement of Shiver and Shake, That Demon's a Snake once again, but I am also a bit surprised by the mid-pack rank for The Demon of the Dugout for both of you. I didn't remember this episode being such a highlight, but it really clicked with me a lot on this watch. It feels just like a TSDS ep with Scrappy (which is always nice), and it's one of those types of episodes that simply has everything you could possibly want. Well, except for a more intricate mystery. But the approach they took with making the gang almost directly target the guy who ended up being the culprit and slowly turning it into a one suspect case was quite cool and done in a pretty neat way.

To expand on something I mentioned in the original comment — Mark Evanier wrote "The Scarab Lives!" and "The Demon of the Dugout", which were the episodes with the best animation, and 2 of my 3 favorites in general. I believe they were better animated because Evanier also storyboarded them afaik, and he's probably good at drawing accurately from his extensive work on comics. I really wish we would've gotten to see Evanier write more Scooby episodes than just these 2, cuz he showed he's more than capable of creating great Scooby content. But instead he was mostly used to just write a whole bunch of the Scooby comics from the '70s (which I obviously haven't read, but I can only assume he did a very good job with them too, seeing he was the main writer there). They could've brought him onto the Scooby animated show department earlier with TSDS for sure; I would've been especially fascinated to see how he'd write an episode without Scrappy.

Matt

4/7/2024 12:30:18 pm

To be fair, I do have Demon of the Dugout in my “Great” tier, I agree completely with your praise of it. I think it is a very fun episode, and one of the better sports stadium episodes in general in the franchise. In general, I don’t think being in the middle of the pack in this season for me is as damning as it is for you lol. And I agree, I would’ve been interested to see more from him. I didn’t know much about who did the episodes but both of those episodes are really good imo

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:21:49 pm

@Becker Thank you, #9 was meant to be "Twenty Thousand Screams Under the Sea."

I enjoyed "The Demon of the Dugout" quite a bit, and I thought #7 was a pretty good ranking for it. The mystery was a tad lacking compared to some other episodes imo, which is what brought it down just a bit, but it's still a very good episode. I haven't seen it in a while though so I'll have to rewatch it soon.

Even if I didn't rank them both at the top, I agree with you that it's a shame Mark Evanier didn't get to write more episodes. I haven't read his comics but I think he did a great job with both of those episodes.

Becker

4/7/2024 01:40:36 pm

It was definitely an obvious mystery, but I enjoyed how even the gang seemed almost self-aware of it, seeing how they'd keep going back to him and then starting to kinda mess with him, while all the other episodic characters only appeared in one scene each. For an easy mystery, they managed to make it feel fresh and engaging, which I think is no small feat.

Matt

4/7/2024 03:26:17 pm

It was definitely an easy mystery, but I'll also say the scene where Velma drops the fake trophy was a really clever clue

Becker

4/7/2024 10:35:18 am

Some more character analysis I feel is needed after the rewatch: Scrappy isn't insufferable most of the time, you get used to him kinda, but he can still be too much a good chunk of the time. Sometimes the episode even comes to a screeching halt due to Scrappy starting to blabber all of a sudden. However, I love Shaggy and Scooby's responses to some of Scrappy's excesses here and there. In fact, Shaggy and Scooby in general are amazing in this show. We definitely could've done with more Fred, Daphne and Velma though, they get pushed to the sidelines or background a lot of the time (some episodes more than others); this has always been another issue that bugged me a bit about this show.

I'd still say without a doubt that TSDS S3 was a significantly better season than SD&SD. As I've said many times, TSDS S3 is the most underrated season of Scooby-Doo, almost on par with the other 2 seasons; while SD&SD is a good season, but a clear step down (even without Scrappy I'd still say it's a weaker season than TSDS S3, though not by as large of a margin). Another thing I wanna mention is that, as much as I defend it, I admit that TSDS S3 didn't end on the strongest of notes — as Matt pointed out, the last 3 episodes were among the weakest of that season. However, I'd like to point out the same can be said about the last 4 episodes of SD&SD, in fact I'd say it's undoubtedly a weaker end to a season than TSDS S3, especially due to that very last SD&SD episode, but not the sole reason.

Matt

4/7/2024 12:54:21 pm

I think we agree a lot more than we did last week with that first paragraph, even if I still definitely like it more than you do. I love Shaggy and Scooby in this season as well, and I do agree that I wish more was done with Fred, Daphne, and Velma. Would’ve been nice to see them strike more of a balance between those three and time for Scrappy. I probably would’ve liked the season even more than I do already

Obviously, I do not agree on SDS season 3 still. I should clarify that I do like the season, I hope me criticizing it hasn’t implied that I don’t like it. It just is not a favorite season of mine, and I see it as having a lot of weak spots. I don’t think it would have a spot in my top 15 seasons across the franchise, which probably isn’t as harsh as it sounds but yeah, pretty low for a classic era season for me. Especially compared to the first and second seasons of the Scooby Doo Show which might be number 3 and 2 respectively in my favorite seasons across the franchise, so I definitely wouldn’t say season 3 is almost on par with those two personally

Not only do I see season 3 as having a weak stretch to close the season, but also having an even weaker starting three episode stretch. I admit that I am pretty much alone on my strong dislike of Willawaw, but I also don’t feel Bermuda Triangle or Snow Beast Fright are very good. They are watchable but among my least favorites of the show. I know you would disagree of course

I, of course, agree that Ransom of Scooby Chief is not only the worst episode of either season, but the worst episode of the entire classic era, so in that sense I definitely agree it is a very weak end to the season. However, I like Minotaur and especially like The Sorcerer’s a Menace, and would probably put Rocky Mountain Yiiii in the same range as Don’t Go Near the Fortress of Fear in terms of liking them, so I wouldn’t agree about that 4 episode stretch being weaker than the three episode stretch beyond the one episode. And it should be no surprise that I’d take the first three episodes of Scooby and Scrappy Doo over the aforementioned first three of Scooby Doo Show season 3 lol

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:44:04 pm

I also didn't really like Fred, Daphne and Velma getting pushed to the side in this series. I think it would have been easy to strike a balance where all six characters got equal focus, so it's a shame that they focused more on Scooby, Shaggy and Scrappy. Shaggy and Scooby are written super well here, but I think Scrappy would have also been more tolerable for people had there been more of a balance where he didn't get so much screen time.

As I've said before, I'm the same way as Matt on The Scooby-Doo Show season 3, although I do like Williwaw and actually like "Don't Go Near the Fortress of Fear" quite a bit too. It's not the strongest episode, but there's definitely much weaker in this season imo, and it's way above "Rocky Mountain Yiiiii!" for me. I really like how Fortress tried to do something different and had Shaggy and Scooby not tell the others about the mystery. The atmosphere of the fortress is kind of cool too, even if it's not as strong as stuff in the first two seasons (or even other episodes in the third season). I agree that Creepy Tangle and Snow Beast Fright are amongst the weakest episodes of the show.

Yeah, "Ransom of Scooby Chief" is easily the worst episode of the classic era, no competition lol.

Becker

4/7/2024 02:07:39 pm

I felt Rocky Mountain Yiiiii and The Sorcerer's a Menace were pretty average episodes, as evident from my ranking. Unlike The Demon of the Dugout, to me The Sorcerer's a Menace was almost reaching frustrating levels of obvious culprit. Rocky Mountain did a better job in that regard. However, the main problem of these 2 episodes for me is that they seem to mostly just focus on the monster trying its damnedest to catch Shaggy and the dogs for whatever reason more than anything else. Fred, Daphne and Velma are more in the background in these 2 than most other eps of the season imo. And I felt the climaxes for both eps were quite silly and contrived.

Lock the Door, It's the Minotaur was easily the best episode of that last quarter of the season. Should've ended with that, because yeah, we know The Ransom of Scooby Chief sucks ass lol. I'm sure I dislike it less than you though, mainly because I know it's one of your absolute least favorites of the franchise, which is a difficult hatred to match lol. If I can say something positive about it, it's that I liked the first minute of it when it actually felt like a Scooby episode with the rest of the gang and the Mystery Machine and whatnot; and the fact that I was quite entertained by Shaggy being so done with everybody and everything more and more throughout the ep (we would've been too in his shoes lol). It does make me wonder though... how would someone watching this episode for the first time react to it? From the first minute they'd think it's just another SD&SD ep, and before they know they're in like a completely different show lmao. They'd be so confused, like: Who tf are these dogs and crooks? Where's the rest of the gang gone? Where's the mystery and monster? This is so stupid, why does this exist? And then when they start watching the next episode of the franchise they'd realize they had just watched a backdoor pilot to the next Scooby show which barely resembles a Scooby show, except instead of 7 minutes it was a full-length ep, so the suffering was just further prolonged.

All good, I know our opinions on these 2 seasons are basically the opposite, but I still do like SD&SD and same for you with TSDS S3. These seem to be the respective seasons we defend the most out of any Scooby season. I'd have to say the beginning of TSDS S3 is stronger than the end, given I love the first and especially the second episode. SD&SD does have a strong start too, but I don't prefer it to the former. And I prefer the end of S3 over this end too. But it's all opinions at the end of the day.

Becker

4/7/2024 02:24:43 pm

@Wildwind, yeah, you're not the biggest fan of either of these 2 seasons, creating more balance here; but afaik I think you enjoy TSDS S3 more, given you agreed at least 10 eps from it are better than The Scarab Lives, which ranked 4th for you.

It's funny how we can say The Ransom of Scooby Chief is easily the worst classic era episode when there's also a big stinker like Jeepers It's the Jaguaro in there lol. That's the one TSDS S3 ep I concede is not good, but even despite that it's no competition for Scooby Chief. Personally, I like to think of the classis Scooby era as '69-'79. Scooby Chief is the only SD&SD ep to come out in 1980, thus excluding it from the classic era and lumping it with the Scrappy shorts where it belongs through these delimitations.

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 02:45:46 pm

@Becker Yeah, I definitely enjoy The Scooby-Doo Show season 3 more. I feel there was a bit more of a balance there with the gang getting relatively equal focus, plus there are a lot more gems in that season than in TS&SDS. TSDS season 3 also the added bonus of not having Weinrib's Scrappy being very annoying at times lol.

Ha! I like your reason for why "The Ransom of Scooby Chief" doesn't count as a part of the classic era lol. Despite not liking it, "Jeepers It's the Jaguaro" is much better than "The Ransom of Scooby Chief" for me. Both episodes would be amongst the last Scooby episodes I'd choose to watch in the classic era, but "Jeepers It's the Jaguaro" is at least more of a tolerable watch than "Ransom of Scooby Chief" is imo, even if it is still bad.

Also, agreed on Rocky Mountain Yiiiii! I like "Sorcerer's a Menace" just a bit better because of the villain and setting were cool, but both episodes definitely had the issue of focusing too much on the monster chasing Shaggy and the dogs, while not developing the mystery hardly at all. Also, yeah "Lock the Door It's a Minotaur" would have made a good finale (obviously a million times better than "The Ransom of Scooby Chief" lol).

Matt

4/7/2024 03:41:13 pm

@Wildwind: I actually would stick up for Don't Go Near the Fortress of Fear before a decent amount of episodes that season. I said that liking Rocky Mountain Yiiii more than just about anyone else around here lol

I definitely do not agree about SDS season 3 being relatively balanced with the gang with all of the time it shows Scooby and Shaggy running around. I'd say gang balance definitely is underwhelming in both seasons. I truly do not believe either Rocky Mountain Yiiii or The Sorcerer's a Menace is any worse than like Iron Face or something in that regard

@Becker: Maybe it was because I was a kid when I first watched it, but I actually remember being surprised by who it was in The Sorcerer's a Menace. I enjoyed the mystery part of the episode a good bit. It's not my favorite of the season or anything but I'll stick up for it.

I can go ahead and tell you my first reaction to Ransom of Scooby Chief was... hating it even more than I do now lol. It pretty much immediately became my all time least favorite episode of Scooby Doo, and at least it isn't there now? Really low bar.

Honestly, Scooby Chief is definitely worse than Jaguaro, but it may be closer than I would have thought, Jaguaro is also genuinely atrocious. Both would be bottom 10 episodes of the franchise for me

Becker

4/7/2024 03:55:01 pm

@Wildwind, I'd take Jaguaro any day of the week over Scooby Chief too. At least Jaguaro can be so bad it's good; Scooby Chief is just so bad it's bad. I think what I hate the most about Scooby Chief is how every single character is portrayed as a dumbass. There are so many dumb decisions made by all the characters throughout the ep, it's ridiculous. It almost enrages me. Shaggy was the only one who acknowledged all the stupid shit happening, but he still made a couple of dumb decisions himself.

Becker

4/7/2024 04:10:08 pm

@Matt, to me we were seeing a lot more of Fred, Velma and Daphne in TSDS S3, both with and without Shaggy and Scooby. I felt the mysteries were being given more attention too. Fred, Velma and Daphne felt much more like characters there, unlike SD&SD where usually Velma would purely be the one with the braincells and nothing else, with Fred and Daphne typically just being in her presence acting like nothing more than support. A lot of the time in SD&SD the forgotten trio would suddenly stumble upon a clue, they'd ask "what is this?" and Velma would go "hmm" and then we'd just move on, more often than not cutting back to the central trio. Iron Face isn't comparable to those episodes to me, as I can actually remember there being focus on the mystery and the gang as a whole, while managing to include great Shaggy and Scooby shenanigans on top of it (which I unashamedly love; Scrappy being in that mix doesn't make them nearly as immensly entertaining and fun).

I don't know if I remember Jaguaro being on your most recent top 10 worst episodes honestly.

Matt

4/7/2024 05:07:02 pm

I definitely don't feel the same way at all. I felt the mystery was absolutely a complete afterthought in Iron Face and an episode like Beast is Awake in Bottomless Lake. I feel the mysteries were not only usually better in the Scrappy season, but more pronounced. Despite having seen Iron Face or Beast is Awake in Bottomless Lake more than The Sorcerer's a Menace for example, I can definitely recall the mystery and clues more vividly than from either of those episodes. Of course I guess it varies per person, but I don't feel the same way as you do there at all

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 06:09:38 pm

@Matt To me, Iron Face is a step up from "Rocky Mountain Yiiiii!" and "The Sorcerer's a Menace." Fred, Velma and Daphne are definitely less present than they are in the other two TSDS seasons, but I agree with what Becker was saying about the scenes with those three in TSDS season 3 feeling more substantive. In TSD&SDS, there were some episodes where it felt like the scenes with Fred, Daphne and Velma were so short that there was almost not anything memorable to them, they were basically just time-fillers to have a break in between the antics ("Rocky Mountain Yiiiii!" being one of those episodes). Sure, there was a heavier focus on antics in both TSDS season 3 and TSD&SDS compared to the rest of the classic era, but Fred, Daphne and Velma's scenes in TSDS season 3 have always felt like they had more substance and contributed to the overall mystery more than they did in TSD&SDS.

I'm actually in the middle on your comment about the mystery being an afterthought in those two episodes. I feel like there was still a decent amount of focus on the mystery in Iron Face, but I agree with you on Bottomless Lake.

"Ransom of Scooby Chief" is in my bottom 10 of the franchise, but not Jaguaro. There are a handful of Scrappy and Yabba shorts I'd put there before Jaguaro.

@Becker Completely agreed on "Ransom of Scooby Chief," it is frustrating how dumb they characterized everybody in that episode imo.

Becker

4/8/2024 02:35:24 am

@Matt, I can't really comment on that, given I've just rewatched SD&SD the past week, so recency bias would play a part. But even as is, with me not having rewatched Iron Face in quite some time, I can still remember the plot, mystery, characters and clues almost as well as these SD&SD eps. Personally, there isn't much focus on the mystery in these eps partly because the scenes with Fred, Daphne and Velma finding said clues are typically so short and treated almost as intermissions for the central trio's escapades. There's only like one clue that's given some more time to marinate and be explored in some of these SD&SD eps (in Rocky Mountain it's the diary, in Sorcerer's a Menace it's the projector). Ultimately it usually comes down to how much attention they offer Fred, Daphne and Velma, and I don't think anyone would disagree they had less screentime and dialogue in SD&SD.

I will concede on Bottomless Lake having about as much focus on the mystery as these SD&SD eps, it does feel like a Scrappy-less SD&SD ep in that regard and I agree it's one of the lesser TSDS eps (despite me still taking it over like half of SD&SD). However, I can't agree on Iron Face, as I not only still remember the mystery, plot, clues and suspects, but I actually think they struck a great balance between those and the antics, but that's just my opinion.

Another related thing that bugs me about SD&SD is that too often the gang is split up, eventually get reunited, only for them to immediately decide to split up again. Rocky Mountain and Sorcerer's a Menace do this repeatingly, they are 2 of the most guilty eps of this plot device in this season. Cuz the issue isn't just that Fred, Daphne and Velma don't get much time on their own, but the whole gang united doesn't get much attention either. And I think TSDS S3 does both of those better.

@Wildwind, I don't even include the Yabba shorts when I talk about worst Scooby eps. Because if I did, they'd all be tied for my worst episode, since I have zero interest to ever watch them. They're not Scooby-Doo eps to me, they're just random shorts attached to a Scooby show that include one of the Scooby-Doo characters.

Juan

4/7/2024 01:36:50 pm

I personally love Ransom of Scooby Chief.

Shadowscooby

4/7/2024 09:22:02 am

Where’s Spooky Space Kook, Jeepers It’s The Creeper, The Ozark Witch Switch, Curse of The Collar, A Scooby Doo Halloween, The Horrible Herd, Spooky Scarecrow and Falling Star Man?

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 09:35:34 am

Some of these would count and I added them, but a few of them just have a farm in one scene (Spooky Space Kook, andJeepers It's the Creeper) and I don't think others would necessarily qualify as a farm (Spooky Scarecrow and The Ozark Switch Witch). Thank you for pointing out the ones I missed!

Shadowscooby

4/7/2024 09:54:56 am

I thought in Jeepers It’s The Creeper the farm is majority of the setting. The gang go to a a school dance at the barn and they have all of those farm antics.

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:45:08 pm

Honestly that's fair, I can add it. It doesn't really come to mind to me as a farm episode, since the barn doesn't necessarily feel like it's on a farm, but between the barn dance, the scene with the chicks, and the trap, that's enough for it to qualify imo.

Matt

4/7/2024 09:22:49 am

5. Ghost of the Red Baron- It’s a shame how weak this one is for me because I really like the villain, setting, and the idea behind the plot. Unfortunately, this episode is by far the biggest example of an episode of this series that does not need to be this long, even if there is another episode that is worse (Mystery in Persia). If Wildwind has an issue with the place scene in Headless Horseman of Halloween, I have a FAR bigger issue with the plane scenes in this episode. It just feels like they go on for ages. Also, the Stooges aren’t my favorite guest stars, which is kind of a shame because I think they could have worked, but there really wasn’t much guest star chemistry with the gang imo.

4. The Bee Team- This is pretty weak for its series as well, and just isn’t very high quality in general, but I have a decent amount of fun with it. I have a better time with it than Ghost of the Red Baron even if I could definitely argue Ghost of the Red Baron is a higher quality episode

3. Eating Crow- Not many notes on this one, fun episode. Not even close to the top two though

2. The Frickert Fracas- Kinda hard not voting for this one because this is a favorite of mine. I always have a blast watching this episode, and as the complete opposite to how I feel about the Stooges as guest stars, I absolutely love Jonathan Winters as a guest star, especially his dynamic with Scooby and Shaggy. This one was close

1. Farmed and Dangerous- Both of the top two are all time favorites of mine, but this is a little higher on that list. This is my second favorite episode of What’s New Scooby Doo (you can probably guess what number one is), and unlike my number one, it is a relatively simple plot idea done super well. All logic should point to me voting Frickert Fracas, but I just adore this episode too much

Matt

4/7/2024 09:45:24 am

Okay so updated list:

9. Falling Star Man- This is one of the better Guess Who episodes for me almost exclusively because I am a Steelers fan. Still last place in this poll though

8. Horrible Herd- Not worse than some others of these, but this does not come to mind even remotely as a farm episode for me

7. Curse of the Collar- Definitely better than all but the top 3, but also does not come to mind

6. Ghost of the Red Baron

5. The Bee Team

4. Eating Crow

3. A Scooby Doo Halloween- Now this is another favorite of mine. Definitely a top ten What’s New episode for me.

2. The Frickert Fracas

1. Farmed and Dangerous

Matt

4/7/2024 10:04:55 am

I just realized the list is missing EIEIO, which would be number 5 for me, fun episode

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:45:39 pm

Thanks for that! I added it. It'd be last place for me, it's a fun enough episode but I don't feel it's particularly strong or memorable.

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:48:42 pm

Also, "Jeepers It's the Creeper" would be between "Falling Star Man!" and "Ghost of the Red Baron," as it doesn't particularly come to mind for me as a farm episode.

Matt

4/7/2024 03:21:18 pm

I'll put Jeepers It's the Creeper at 4 here I guess

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 10:00:25 am

9. The Bee Team - While I do appreciate the quirky villain choice for this episode, as well as Mr. BLT, this was a pretty easy last place choice.

8. Falling Star Man! - definitely one of the better episodes of Guess Who, although it does have one of the cringiest moments of the series lol. https://ibb.co/sRS6t8K

7. The Ghost of the Red Baron - a good episode with a solid foundation of a plot and setting, but the execution wasn't the greatest. I agree Moe, Larry and Curly don't have as good of chemistry with the gang as they do in "Ghastly Ghost Town," and I definitely have more issue with the plane scenes in this episode than I do in "The Headless Horseman of Halloween."

6. Horrible Herd - doesn't come to mind as a farm episode, but the quality of this episode brings it above the other two for me.

5. Curse of the Collar - would be much closer to the top if I were ranking based on quality alone, but it doesn't come to mind at all as farm episode.

4. Eating Crow - great Be Cool episode with an awesome villain! The only aspect of the episode I didn't like about the episode was the stuff with Velma's allergies, which I thought got to the point of being kinda gross.

3. A Scooby-Doo Halloween - great episode! I guess this one fits the theme just a little more but still doesn't come to mind as a farm episode.

2. The Frickert Fracas - really tough call for me here because I love both of the top 2 and would be happy if either one wins. One of the best episodes of the series, and Jonathan Winters is easily one of the best guest stars. Like Matt mentioned, his chemistry with Shaggy and Scooby is awesome and this one is so much fun.

1. Farmed and Dangerous - it was very close, but I thought the setting was incredible here and the Demon Farmer had a super cool design. Very close but ultimately this one stands out to me just a little more than "The Frickert Fracas."

Matt

4/7/2024 10:29:18 am

9. Justice for Mr. BLT

8. Oh my GOODNESS, that is horrible. I feel less bad about putting this in last place now

2. Winters really does make this one just such a good time. He might be my favorite guest star that isn’t a group like Harlem Globetrotters or Batman and Robin. Yes, even over the great Don Knotts, which is really saying something

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:46:52 pm

2. I wouldn't put him above the Globetrotters or Don Knotts, but he'd be third place for me.

Shadowscooby

4/7/2024 10:18:28 am

Farmed and Dangerous for me.

Shadowscooby

4/7/2024 10:23:27 am

The Horrible Herd:
I liked this episode. It was pretty intense. The Horrible Heard were great, creepy, original, creative, and scary villains. It’s cool that they are a mixture of cows, bees and piranhas and that they were destroying the peoples farms and the roads and buildings Crystal Cove.

It was cool that all the attacks on Velma’s computer map formed the magnifying glass that the original mystery incorporated used.

We learned that Mayor Janet Nettles was in the Air Force. She and Sheriff Stone share their first kiss in this episode.

They saved the town by sending the horrible heard in the water after their Queen but they now endangered the ecosystem.

Nova falling out of the plain and getting hurt at the end with Scooby being distraught was emotional.

WildwindVampire link

4/7/2024 01:48:05 pm

This was a good episode! The Horrible Herd were super unique villains! Yeah, the scene with Nova was definitely intense and emotional.

Carson Maitland - Smith

4/7/2024 10:10:42 pm

Jeepers its the Creeper

JakeSDfan27

4/8/2024 04:10:20 pm

Jeepers, It's the Creeper (Great)

The Frickert Fracas (Good)

The Ghost of the Red Baron (Good)

Curse of the Collar (Great, Spooky, Creepy and Personal)

A Scooby Doo Halloween (Great, Creepy and Super Spooky)

Farmed and Dangerous (Great, Scary and Personal)

The Horrible Herd (Great, Scary, Intense and Personal)

Eating Crow (Good and Really Creepy)

Falling Star Man! (Great and Creepy)

WildwindVampire link

4/8/2024 05:32:55 pm

Great ratings, Jake, thanks for sharing!

Weekly Poll #225

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